Fable III Ignores Experience by Ditching XP Bar
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Radical Fable update will have serious impact on gaming experience.
Fable III will be a serious departure from the original two Fable titles according to Lionhead overlord Peter Molyneux.
Speaking at the Microsoft X10 event, Mr Molyneux revealed that Fable was moving away from its RPG routes, discarding health and experience bars to move to a more action orientated adventure game.
It’s a potentially disastrous move, but a plucky one; it would be all too easy to make Fable III a carbon-copy of the successful Fable II template with a new script and a few minor design tweaks. The desire at Lionhead to pursue innovation and originality in gaming has pushed Molyneux and his team to radically change Fable so that the third instalment provides a new experience, but messing with a formula that works and that fans like could be dangerous.
Even before X10, Molyneux admitted that he was worried about a negative backlash in light of the impending changes: “There’s just some very, very big things happening in Fable. Bigger than you think. And it’s going to really upset people,” he said in an interview with Game Reactor, “I’m really scared that when I go out and tell people what it is, they’re going to get super pissed off.”
So Fable III won’t be an RPG in the traditional sense, much like other titles have borrowed from different genres to make successful hybrid games such as Bioshock or more recently Mass Effect 2.
In place of the experience bar, player progression will come automatically as characters pick up new weapons and armour.
Players will be able to gather legions of followers as their reputation grows in the game, but having XP in order to level is a thing of the past as far as Molyneux is concerned: “Experience seemed 1990s, it seemed old school,” Eurogamer reported.
Try telling that to the hordes of fans engrossed in any MMORPG such as Warhammer Online or World of Warcraft, the experience bar is still very much alive and kicking there. However, Fable‘s XP has never been as simplistic as other formats, and Molyneux’s vision is to get back to basics, solid gameplay rather than over-complicated game features.
Taking a leaf out of his own book of sage advice, Molyneux is stripping what he sees as unnecessary chaff from Fable III to leave a core of enjoyable gaming. “It took me years and years of stupid mistakes to realize one thing simple is, making something complex doesn’t make something good. As I used to keep adding game feature after game feature after game feature, without thinking about the fundamental things, in every feature you add to a game, a player has to understand,” quoted PC World.
Experience in Fable was an overly complex game feature: “The absolute main reason is that most people didn’t really understand it. When you asked people how to get red experience, they’d say, ‘I don’t know, sometimes it’s green. Sometimes it’s red, sometimes it’s blue,” Molyneux revealed.
So XP is gone. Some fans will undoubtedly, in Mr Molyneux’s own words be “super pissed off” but the reasons behind the decisions are sound. Lionhead don’t wish to rest on their laurels – they desire to challenge gamers, and with that desire, gamers should be happy.
What do you think of the Fable III changes? Do you agree with ditching XP? Write a comment in the box below to share your thoughts on the latest developments.
I always just enjoyed the game for the sake of playing it. XP didn’t really play that big a role in the game for me. I think it’s a great idea to do away with it.
Fable is an RPG, it always has been. Fable: The Lost Chapters was the best game Lionhead had produced. They are retarded to take away the XP part of an RPG.
Seriously? People didn’t understand color-coded experience? THAT WAS SO SIMPLE!!! I have no doubt that that is BS. So basically they removed the part of the game that allowed you to customize your character. Experience is so 1990s? No, character development like that seen in Sonic the Hedgehog is 1990s. Now we’ll be stuck with buying skills it seems. That’s an idiotic choice. I just wish that developers would realize that just because one of their games sells, that doesn’t mean the changes are good. I’ll still buy Fable 3, and I’m sure many others will too, but this was a step in the wrong direction, and Lionhead will never realize it because the game will sell. Stupid.
Character customization? In Fable?! Ha! Sure you might play the first half of the game differently, but everyone maxes out their character before too long. Different means, same end.
Will it be fun?
Hmm, yeah, that’s something Peter Molyneux would do. It’s a good thing to see a game studio who’s not afraid of trying something new.
Looking forward to seeing what Fable III is gonna be like.
The stupid ray hits another game. This seems like another attempt to make a game appealing to the drooling masses that can barely understand the “complexites” of Madden, while at the same time telling its current fan base to (changed for politeness) get lost.
I’m not sure if I like this yet. I enjoyed BS and ME (BTW, ME2 did have experience) for what they were – great games. But I enjoyed the first two Fables for being different and unique. So, I’m not too sure if I like this. That being said, I have great faith in Peter, and I’m sure he’ll pull it off. Still excited.
I think it’s actually a really smart move. Risky, but smart. I think this could be the route all future RPGs go.
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I think of Molyneux like I think of Terry Gilliam, an idea man in search of someone that can execute his ideas. I love the game he talks about but not the one that gets shipped. Maybe by stripping out all the unnecessary bits he will finally put out the product I’ve been waiting for.
Sounds like a spoilt brad d:ck head!
How old is he?
I’m looking forward to it.
Who didn’t understand how the experience worked? Each colour corresponded to a different style of play, arguably the best type of experience bars in modern gaming. That being said, I am intrigued to see what’s in store for the franchise.
The important question is, Will It Blend?
I don’t know. Can we get a Blendtec to test it?
XP isn’t important in my eyes, it’s just a game feature. If you’ve built your game around a leveling system, then it might be important to your game. As long as the game is well designed, no one will really care if it has XP or not. For the record though, I promote no XP in RPGs… well, smarter XP gaining, not so much no XP.
Bloodlines has the best XP system to date IMO (I think Mass Effect 2 was the same, not sure, would have to double check ME2).
In Bloodlines you got XP for completing objectives only. This meant that if you were stealthy and avoided fighting a group of enemies, you never felt like you were screwing yourself over. As long as you got past them and did what you needed to do, you got your exp. for that objective. It worked well.
“Experience in Fable was an overly complex game feature: “The absolute main reason is that most people didn’t really understand it. When you asked people how to get red experience, they’d say, “I don’t know, sometimes it’s green. Sometimes it’s red, sometimes it’s blue,” Molyneux revealed.”
That does make it sound like they are dumbing it down for the sake of casual gamers though. Again, maybe not a bad thing, but if the game feels like it’s missing a depth to your character this may be why.
It truly did combat was easy auto win the entire game was a simple auto win barely took any time at all to beat.
Oblivion with OOO mod>fables.
“Try telling that to the hordes of fans engrossed in any MMORPG such as Warhammer Online or World of Warcraft, the experience bar is still very much alive and kicking there”
Not sure about Warhammer – but the real WOW game begins AFTER you reach max level and XP loses its importance. You play to get armor and weapons – this may be what Fable III is similar to.
Think of Zelda. There is an example of an RPG that never relied on XP for growth and progress. Yes, there is the growing health bar in the form of pieces of heart, but all other growth comes from collecting items that grant new abilities.
It’s a great idea. I’ve been awaiting this kind of direction since – like he said – the 1990s.
Looking forward to the experience.
When I play games like Fable, Mass Effect, Dragon’s Age, what draws me in is a story that grabs and won’t let go. If I find myself having a hard time turning the game off I know the story is a hit. Any features / mechanics that sort of interrupt that are a pain.
Personally I wasn’t as impressed with F2 as I thought I was going to be. The lack of a map really pissed me off more than anything else. I am interested to see how this new direction goes. I still think there is some really good things that can come of the Fable franchise.
I’m just worried that Fable without RPG elements like experience will just be God of War set in the Fable universe. And if I want to play God of War, I’ll go play that instead of a remade Fable of War.
“Overly complicated”???? Who were they asking? 8 year olds?
I loved the XP system in Fable. You leveled up depending on your play style, it made perfect sense. You use guns, you level up your guns. Simple. Not only that, but it was already an evolution of the basic grindy RPG.
I think this is an unnecessary change, BUT it could definitely still be fun.
Complete a task/quest, get a buff, companion, or new toy. Zelda is an original no-XP RPG, so no XP adventure games have been around. I can see how Fable kind of lends itself to it. I don’t think there’s a problem with dropping it.
Don’t these people understand the fundamental success of Zelda is the action-RPG element.
Sounds like they are simply implementing a black and white style experience system. The more evil you are, the more evil you look (wow, wasn’t this the innovative idea that made BW such a huge hit?). Obviously this game is going to be a slightly improved version of Fable 2, integrating more black and white style features. I’m sure new skills will be acquired in this manner, rather than using experience.
I thought the XP system in Fable was actually one of it’s defining features. The only problem I had with the game was the story. While I don’t have a problem with no-XP action-adventure games, it almost feels like it won’t be a Fable game any more. Now it’ll be like any other no-XP action adventure with only the plot to set it apart from other games. And if the plot is as disappointing as I thought the other Fables were, I’m seriously going to be pissed.
Why are we talking about Fable 3 when Fable 2 isn’t even available on PC yet?
Who needs XP for god’s sake! Just make it an interesting and exciting game experience and I’ll buy it. In fact it already sounds like I’ll enjoy this more than the first two put together.
I’m not too sure what to think. When Molyneux announced the dog in Fable II, I immediately shit all over the idea and every video for it made me cringe. Then, when I actually played the game and saw the dog, I realised that he hadn’t made the biggest blunder in game development I’ve ever witnessed, he was actually sincere when he said that I was going to love that dog. I did. I really did.
Sure, he was a little retarded, and so was the bread-crumb trail (more often leading me in the wrong direction than the right one), but I actually liked that dog. I think it was because he got me treasures, which was trite by the end but it still made me smile to look at him, his head twisting frantically and body glitching in a rock.
My point is, even though I thoroughly hate the idea of wrenching customisation from my previously excited hands, it might actually go well.
When you think about it, I can guarantee that every player worth his weight in salt already had his stats maxed before 3/4 through either Fable. Maybe we won’t miss it. Maybe he’ll replace it with pure awesome, refined in places to produce infinite wells of glorious gaming. Or maybe we shall shit on Fable III
Very excited to see how this game turns out. I love when designers strip “essential” parts out of a game, because there is an immediate burst in creative problem solving that (usually) makes the game much stronger.
This is similar to Dyson making a “bladeless” fan — essentially, the fan blades are still there, but they’ve been incorporated into the product in a very different way that makes it unique.
Same thing with Fable III — the XP system will still exist in the game, perhaps just not the way we’re used to.
gwenmurray.net
Played 1 and 2 because they were RPGs, I wont play yet another RPG turned action game.
“Experience seemed 1990s, it seemed old school”
XP was neat in the 80s, with Final Fantasy and Dragon Warrior. It got old by the early 90s. I don’t know why anybody continued to lean on it after that.
Grinding is one of the most complained about “features” in MMORPGs, so that doesn’t exactly vindicate it. It is so bad, that players will actually pay somebody to do that part for them.
I approve of this decision, but unless they release Fable III on Linux, it doesn’t really affect me personally.
What hurt Fable II in my eyes was the fact that they ditched the in game (no pause) menu and hot keys. Having to go through all those menus every time I want to use an item is absolutely ridiculous.
Half the fun in Fable I was setting beer to your hot keys and getting the guy drunk, but in Fable 2 they punished you for trying to have fun with those damn menus and making your character get fat too easy.
Even though a bunch of you are QQ’ing about the XP changes, you’ll still go and rent/buy the game as all fanboys do.
“Making something complex doesn’t make something good”
“There’s just some very, very big things happening in Fable. Bigger than you think. And it’s going to really upset people.”
Dear Peter, stop redesigning things and make the original concept better instead, stop promising a thousand times more than you can ever deliver.
After I got bored with Fable II after about two hours, I pretty much gave up on Fable III, and this makes me shy away from it even more. I was hoping Fable III would bring back what made the first one great but I guess, just like Fable II, I’ll be playing a completely different game with Highwayman gear being the poster child clothing.
I think that not having the XP bar will be an upset but is really a good idea. It will make the game easier but interesting on how you get stronger.
So the further you get, the more powerful you get? Gone are the days of grinding and power leveling. Now we’ll have to play the game. I like it.
Dumb. Won’t even buy it.
Fable I was great, but some kind of multiplayer would have been the bee’s knees. Fable II was a fucking disaster, weak multiplayer and even weaker story IMO. Hopefully they’ll bring back the story that intrigued me in Fable I and impress me with a decent multiplayer. That’s what it would take for Lionhead to get my respect back.
Neither Fable game was as good as the reviews claimed. The game should try something different.
Wow, this isn’t tight whatsoever. I mean it starts off as an RPG for the first two games and then what?!? Turns into Halo? You pretty much fill up the toilet and don’t flush, you get us excited with the first two and then you fuck it up!
I can’t get enough of Fable 2 and loved the first one as well – they have turned out to be my favorite games. I like RPGs! Don’t piss on a great title… keep XP!!!
I think Peter Molyneux is the antichrist incarnate. He is part of the movement to dumb games down to drooling farting, squelching moronic shite that no one with half a brain would want to be bothered with.
One day, there will be only console games and they’ll be shite, wait and see! The old days of the creative genius in games which revolutionised the industry are over. They will be remembered as the golden age of gaming one day when the history of gaming is written. The games industry will go the same way as the film industry but will probably end up in a worse state.
I’m glad to see Lionhead challenging themselves and wanting to bring something new to gamers. You mention the experience meter being to popular in MMOs. These are proven to be based on mice hitting a lever, action and reward type experiments. Yes, the player will hit that lever over and over to recieve a pellet, but that doesn’t mean they enjoy the game. Only that they want another pellet.
That was the dumdest mistake they could make there right am Pissed Of.
Personally I liked Jack of Blades, and the story of the Queen and Knight vs the Archon.
If the game returns to their story and the Sword of Aeons, I’d be happy. Exp or no exp doesn’t matter if the story is good and the game is fun. Could be like FF9 where you get skills from the items you have and become permanent over time for all I care. In a way it’ll make the game more challenging, that way you can’t just powerlevel in the first few areas and become uber.
I’d actually like to see more penalties in game, rezzing with a scar or having access to a billion health potions is sorta broken.
All we can do is wait until it’s out and see if we like the game then. Personally Lost Chapters has been the best fable experience for me but, as I said before, I’m a big fan of Jack.
Tell you the truth, I never really understood the diff between the colours myself until I played the game for the second time. : /
Meh. Who cares any more? As long as it replaced with something better than worst.
If we’re able to change equipts/skills then it would be ok.